Starting with or with out dual batterys?

J

Jeremy D. Ledford

PCS Volunteer Chapter President
When starting a car with dual batteries for say like the first time in 20+ years (hoping the engine will be free but hasn't been checked just yet) can or do you need to have two fresh batteries in a car like in a 72 M-M Lifeliner or can the car be cranked over using just one fresh/good battery? Car still has old batteries in place (that are both shot of course) and this car has the Cole-Hersee switch on the transmission hump.
 
I would think one good battery would suffice. The whole idea behind the dual battery setup is to have one battery dedicated to starting/running the vehicle, and another battery (usually deep cycle) to run all the extra accessories like lights, sirens, etc. The isolator keeps the light and sirens from running down the starting battery so you can still start it after it has been sitting with the lights on for a long period of time.
 
Remove BOTH dead batteries. Replace with one good one. That will suffice. If you don't remove the old batteries and try to jump them, the good battery will get drained immediately by the bad ones. That won't work. Words of experience!!
 
I'd NEVER try to start a cold,dead coach without at least: Pulling plugs and lubing each hole, doing a qwikee oil change...including priming the new filter and trying to hand crank the engine and then trying to get it to crank with ignition lead pulled. Others to do are draining gas tank and changing the fuel filter after blowing out the line.

Years ago I saw a shop trying to start a cold, long dead Caddy that wouldn't start. A Einstein went and got some av gas...It wasn't pretty.
 
David Martin said:
I'd NEVER try to start a cold,dead coach without at least: Pulling plugs and lubing each hole, doing a qwikee oil change...including priming the new filter and trying to hand crank the engine and then trying to get it to crank with ignition lead pulled. Others to do are draining gas tank and changing the fuel filter after blowing out the line.
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I know the ground work mentioned above is already being laid out before attempting to crank the car.:thumb::thankyou2:
Just wasn't sure if one or two batteries were needed as the Lifeliner is a two battery system/set up.:confused2:
 
I agree with all the above comments, but especially emphasize David's concerns about merely trying to resurrect a 20-year sleeper with only a new battery, assuming that's what you're doing. In recent history, we've brought 5 cars back to life very successfully after long, 10+ year hibernations, but we went all through the mechanicals before ever turning the key.

'72 Lifeliner, eh? Any images you'd care to share at this point?
 
When I got my first criterion it had sat for more than 10 years and last owner never tried to start it at all. I bought two of the highest amp batteries I could get and installed, turned key on and noticed gas guage didn't work and after pecking around on tank figured it was out so put five gallons of fuel in, poured cup full in the carb, set the choke, and fired it right up without a hitch. Guess I was lucky, didn't pull any plugs or do anything to prep the engine. She smoked alittle for a while and after that was fine. Tranny few quarts low but after filling it up that was fine too. If it was running ok before it should be fine. I really like the two batteries especially trying to start a car that has sat a while. If fuel tank is empty you may be lucky there too.
 
I agree with the above comments. It is always cheap insurance to lube the topend. It only takes a few minutes to pull the plugs and put in a few spoonfuls of oil. If you turn it by hand you can feel if any of the valves are stuck. If they are, pour some marvel mystery oil or diesel into the motor and let it sit a day or two and then try to crank it by hand. Then if everything turns smoothly use the starter to turn it over a few times then put the plugs back in or replacements. Then use the starter. If you have a stuck valve, you could end up with much more work. My 64 was delivered with a stuck valve and the wisdom saved me a bunch of work. I filled it with diesel until it ran out of the exhaust and I let it sit a week then tried again by hand and it freed up after many turns back and forth turning the crank until it freed up. The valve was stuck open and stopped the motor from turning over.
 
me I'm like Danny. 9 times out of 10 you brake something messing around. bump the engine over first and you will know if something is stuck. you state dumping a lot of stuff down there you flood the plugs and never get it started. but if your going to dump anything in the top used sea foam. it will burn. the engine will fire on it
it will run good on one battery, the caddy did, a Hearse does. just watch were you put the hot cable in the empty battery tray. just in case some one turns both on. a trick is to stuff it in a plastic bottle. a used engine will have the cylinder walls impregnated with oil so unless some one left it with out the air cleaner on and it filled a cylinder with water it won't be locked up. but if it fires check it right away for fuel running out of the carburetor. the big thing is the needle valve sticking open and flooding the top of the engine with fuel.
 
Todd Merrifield said:
I would think one good battery would suffice. The whole idea behind the dual battery setup is to have one battery dedicated to starting/running the vehicle, and another battery (usually deep cycle) to run all the extra accessories like lights, sirens, etc. The isolator keeps the light and sirens from running down the starting battery so you can still start it after it has been sitting with the lights on for a long period of time.
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Should be clear by the other posts, but to clarify what I said, it should start fine with 1 good/new battery, but don't combine a new battery with an old one. Those old dial switches have a position for "both", which, as others have said, is not something you want to do. Combining a good battery with an old one will quickly give you two mediocre batteries, niether of which will start the car, and may not start it when combined either. Two new batteries are probably overkill until you see what you are dealing with. I would first disconnect both batteries that are in there, then remove the starting battery and replace it with a new one. Leave the other one disconnected like Ed said for the time being. Make sure you set the switch to the "new" battery, and that should be enough.
 
Tony Karsnia said:
I agree with all the above comments, but especially emphasize David's concerns about merely trying to resurrect a 20-year sleeper with only a new battery, assuming that's what you're doing. In recent history, we've brought 5 cars back to life very successfully after long, 10+ year hibernations, but we went all through the mechanicals before ever turning the key.

'72 Lifeliner, eh? Any images you'd care to share at this point?
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I was thinking the very same thing Tony. Come on Jeremy, spill the beans on what you bought. :eek: I always start and run on two batteries but do advise getting the highest cranking battery you can. I currently have one 800 amp cranking power and a 850 amp cranking power. Larger is better like we've never heard that before!
 
some people just got no imagination. it clear as mud what is being worked on is a 72 MM ambulance. life liner would be the one with the 54 in roof. lets see chassis by Cadillac with a 472 engine and turbo 400 tranny. body by MM division of the Wayne division of the Indian Head corporation. what else is there to know
 
John ED Renstrom said:
some people just got no imagination. it clear as mud what is being worked on is a 72 MM ambulance. life liner would be the one with the 54 in roof. lets see chassis by Cadillac with a 472 engine and turbo 400 tranny. body by MM division of the Wayne division of the Indian Head corporation. what else is there to know
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Richard wants to know if the back bumper is good. :hide:
 
Spilling the beans!!!

Richard Vyse said:
I was thinking the very same thing Tony. Come on Jeremy, spill the beans on what you bought. :eek:
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Richard Vyse said:
Since Jeremy sold me the bumpers last time, I'm looking for a right rear once again. I used the one I had for the Criterion. :applause:
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AHHHHH HAAAAAAA!!!!:yum: Cought him finally!!!:batterUp:

Finally get the fish to bite and take the hook!!!!:yankchain: Woooooo Hooooooo!!!!!:rofl1:

Now I know how Bill Dance feels after catchn that big ole bass everytime!!!


Welp! Something has been brewing! Actually for a little over 30 years. So lets hit the rewind button here first and go back to the early 1980's. So set back, find something to drink and heck, even fire up a cigar if ya like! This is gonna take a few minutes here! I was a very young kid at the time, about 4 or 5 years old maybe. Funeral homes here were still running ambulances as convalescent units at the time in 1983-1984. And of course our funeral homes were the last still doing it at this moment in time. We had two ambulances and three combination coaches in the fleet at this time. The two ambulances were a 1967 Miller-Meteor Cadillac 42" Classic limousine style ambulance and a 1972 Miller-Meteor Cadillac 54" Lifeliner ambulance. As a kid I remember the two red ambulances and the combos out on calls and every time I visited one of our funeral homes I always went out back to check out and climb all over the cars! I remember having to stand on the rear bumper step just to look into the rear of the Lifeliner! Both cars were purchased new by Nave Funeral Home of Lebanon and Watertown, TN. and at that time my funeral home here in Watertown was still known as Nave Funeral Home as well. In about 1984 the funeral home got out of the ambulance business altogether and my boss Mike Hunter took over the Watertown operation and changed the name to Hunter Funeral Home as its known today. The two M-M ambulances remained out behind the funeral home in Lebanon till about 1990, then they disappeared. But it wasn't long till I found out where they were and who had them and they were both still in town from our family friend Gordon King who operated a wrecker service and a Phillips 66 service station in town at that time and he had towed them out to their new home. During the next 20 years or so I kept very close tabs on them. In about 2000 I was introduced to the current owner and we became friends. In about 2005 he came to me about getting the 67 M-M into the restoration shop and would be needing my assistance in getting things properly put back on the car and finding parts as if it were new and still in service during the restoration process. Sadly to say both ambulances had set outside one parked behind the other from 1990 till 2005 when the 67 M-M was finally sent off to the shop and yes time had taken a toll on both coaches. The 67 was on the verge of being beyond restoration but the ole 72 M-M had held up much better for some reason. Now fast forward up till last month just before Thanksgiving. We went out to my friends storage building where the 72 M-M was still parked outside to round up some parts for the shop who has the 67 M-M. When I get there he says I need to talk to ya about something, the red and white hightop ambulance. He said I know that car means alot to to you and I've got to thin out some projects. So we talked, he named a price and it became mine. I went out a couple times afterwards to soak the lug nuts to remove the tires and rims and went out Thanksgiving morning and put a good set of CC rims with good tires on it to get it mobile enough to roll onto a roll back wrecker. And believe it or not all four wheels turned with little persuasion too! So the following Sunday I sent a rollback out to bring her home and she's been at her new home with me for about three weeks now! Haven't gotten to do much to her with the Holidays and the busy FH schedule and all so its probably gonna be after the first of the year till I really get can into her! As for the Lifeliner questions most but the one about the batteries was set up as bait (along with the ***Coming Attraction***) slot on my signature for Richard! I'll admit that!!! Pictures will follow, so no need to fret! And as you can tell this car is really special and has sentimental value to me means a lot and has a rich history! It was the last new professional car based ambulance delivered in Wilson County Tennessee. It was the last professional car based ambulance in service here in our county. It was my funeral homes last ambulance and most of all this 72 M-M Lifeliner along with that 67 M-M Classic ambulance are the two cars that started all the madness, sickness or what ever you want to call the reason that I'm here, in this club and in this hobby!!!

This is where it all began!!!

The next posting will be the pictures and a little more about the current state of the Lifeliner!
 
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